Hunters

This is the place for discussion and voting on various aspects of werewolf life, social ideas, physical appearance, etc. Also a place to vote on how a werewolf should look.
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Post by CrewWolf » Mon Nov 14, 2005 6:59 pm

I'd think werewolf hunters would know the risks of becoming a werewolf quite well and would've pondered the possibility extensively. A werewolf hunter might be reluctant to kill a fellow hunter-turned-werewolf but he or she might also think that they're performing an act of mercy by putting their friend down, and the execution may even be expected for both parties.

I can't imagine how the issue wouldn't be brought up between hunters or in the privacy of their mind beforehand. Hunters would either agree not to hesitate in killing a friend or themselves, or they could continue their crusade against werewolves until there is only one left to kill and the future is up to them from there.

Or maybe they'll finally see the light and realize that werewolves are people too from which point they'll join a werewolf society and live happily ever after but with a touch of regret and depression in between, but they'll be amongst supportive friends who are absolutely delighted to be among a person who's killed family members and friends but who truly feels sorry about it so that's okay. Yeah.
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Post by Shadow Wulf » Mon Nov 14, 2005 7:15 pm

I bet if a hunter has a wife or a girlfriend that turned into a werewolf and enjoys it, then he would become a werewolf too.
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Post by Akela » Mon Nov 14, 2005 8:05 pm

I doubt they would have made the comitment to become a hunter in the first place if they did that.

But that is of course if they actually did the fighting themselves they could just use guerilla tactics, that's what I'd do, cap him with a sniper from a mile away and high tail it.... or....*ponders strange genetic experiments to aid in the hunt*

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Post by vrikasatma » Mon Nov 14, 2005 10:24 pm

I'm currently researching a story. There's hunters in it, but for the most part they're just bad seed types, the kind of xenophobic people who don't like anything that deviates from what they perceive as the norm. Mostly they're the type who are entranced by trivial nonsense and drudgery, materialism, gossip, acquisitiveness. You know the type — "Your a freek, you shouldn't exist, I'm gonna kill you!" They may or may not believe in werewolves or even be religious, they just don't like differentness.

It's a semi-allegorical tale: the "hunters" represent aggressive mundanity and mediocrity. To them, the lineup on yesterday's Jerry Springer show is more important than anything else except maybe their next sixpack and carton of Marlboros. They'd rather race down to the bistro for their caffeine fix than watch a meteor shower. A sort of backlash/balancing factor against the extraordinary, the miraculous, the superlative, which is what the werewolves represent.
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Post by Akela » Tue Nov 15, 2005 1:26 am

Interesting... they seem a little lackluster.

My own interpretation of hunters which are basically an adaptation of my favorite fictional universe are far different. They wouldn't necessarily see werewolves as a religous stigma but view them as deformed mutants. They would exterminate beings such as werewolves not out of hate but to preserve humanity's purity from a degeneration of sort. The want to keep the race small, here's a good analogy:

An unarmed werewolf could easily kill something like a bear, an unarmed human would have a much more difficult time killing such an animal but if they succeeded they would have bettered themself by killing it more than a werewolf would have. The human has already proven it kind survive against a much larger and stronger foe while the werewolf has not and might have a more difficult time against stronger foes than a human does against stronger foes.

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Isn't that view a little narrow as well? Why would there not be a female hunter?

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Post by white » Tue Nov 15, 2005 1:49 am

I don't think that's what Shadow meant; he was saying that if a loved one was transformed, it might give a hunter pause to reconsider his philosiphy.

Moving on. I can see hunters wanting to maintain a "purity," but I don't quite follow your analogy. It's easy enough to extrapolate from a werewolf's easy domination of, say, a bear to show that, confronted with a creatore of size/strength difference equivalent to that between bear and man, that one would be placed in a similar situation.

Besides, for the most part, hasn't humanity survived bears by avoiding them? There are plenty of creatures out there which could easily take out a human, but we live on anyway. Or will so long as we don't start hanging out with, say, deadly jellyfish all the time.
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Post by Lupin » Tue Nov 15, 2005 1:58 am

Shadow Wulf wrote:I bet if a hunter has a wife or a girlfriend that turned into a werewolf and enjoys it, then he would become a werewolf too.
I don't really know about that. Depending on the person they might reconsider their position. Or they might end up killing their spouse. Who knows.
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Post by Akela » Tue Nov 15, 2005 2:02 am

Ralith Lupus wrote:I don't think that's what Shadow meant; he was saying that if a loved one was transformed, it might give a hunter pause to reconsider his philosiphy.

Moving on. I can see hunters wanting to maintain a "purity," but I don't quite follow your analogy. It's easy enough to extrapolate from a werewolf's easy domination of, say, a bear to show that, confronted with a creatore of size/strength difference equivalent to that between bear and man, that one would be placed in a similar situation.

Besides, for the most part, hasn't humanity survived bears by avoiding them? There are plenty of creatures out there which could easily take out a human, but we live on anyway. Or will so long as we don't start hanging out with, say, deadly jellyfish all the time.
That's not really my point, the point is if there are multiple scenarios where an unharmed human is forced to fight a bear, not all will survive where as an unarmed werewolf should be able to beat a bear in all scenarios unlike the human.

With werewolves even the weak would survive, without, only the strong survive maintaining the strength and purity of the species.

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Post by vrikasatma » Tue Nov 15, 2005 2:06 am

Akela wrote:Interesting... they seem a little lackluster.
That's kind of the idea. To give you an archetypal touchstone, I went to the "Baron Munchausen/Mr. Jackson" dichotomy. Miracles happen, the fantastic is real — some people don't want to admit it and will do anything and everything in their power to be right, even in the face of overwhelmidence that they're wrong.

How do you counter the fantastic? With the crushing mundane. You and I of course would much rather watch the meteor shower than play Keno while swilling down a Coors Light, but to some people, that's all they want or care about. I'm trying to say to the reader, "Try to look past your next Vonage bill. Beyoncé can wait. It's a big rich wonderful world, go take a dumpster-diving safari!"

I guess I'm taking something of a Swiftian approach to my writing, high satire. Remember they locked Gulliver up when he returned from his travels? In Mage:the Ascension, the forces of cynical conformity labeled the Traditions as "reality deviants" and ultimately wiped them out, to the chagrin of everyone else.
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Post by celtwolf » Tue Nov 15, 2005 12:27 pm

ok, this is something i've been waiting to discuss!

ok, i agree with the religious nuts and the freak-killers, but i'd like to add another group to the mix. those who are out for revenge.
you see, one can assume that, once changed into a werewolf, a person pretty much has NO chance of living a normal life with those they are close to because they would DEFINITELY notice a change in behavior and appearnace and ask questions, and likely get answers. so one can assume that, to protect themselves and those they cared about in their once-normal life, a new werewolf would have to leave them. this simple act could be preformed in any number of ways, many of which could lead to anger and resentment toward the person and those who took him/her away. thus, another possability that arises is that someone will hunt for the person to either kill those who took him/her away, or to ask questions. both of which aren't all that good for werewolf privacy, or safety.
another possable group to add, i don't know if one might call them 'hunters' per se, are those that want to prove werewolf's existance. those who believe and got a hint that werewolves exist would probably follow that hint, trying to show that they aren't insane.
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Post by white » Tue Nov 15, 2005 3:13 pm

Akela wrote:That's not really my point, the point is if there are multiple scenarios where an unharmed human is forced to fight a bear, not all will survive where as an unarmed werewolf should be able to beat a bear in all scenarios unlike the human.

With werewolves even the weak would survive, without, only the strong survive maintaining the strength and purity of the species.
There are plenty of things, other werewolves among them, that'd cause problems for a werewolf, and could even kill one off. Besides, if these people were so fanatic about that standpoint, what'd happen if they took a look at modern society? Everyone survives, because no life threatening challenges show up regularly. So, in fact, humanity would be much more 'impure' than any werewolf.
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Post by Timber-WoIf » Tue Nov 15, 2005 4:39 pm

Gah... i never liked loner tactics... werewolf hunters would have to be goups of people, all of them armed. More likely some type of corperate contractor group, with the supporting logistical and informational units. At least in a modern world. Pre-WWII, i suppose the classic crusader would be possible, but modern society is far too intergrated to allow any lone wolves, hunter or lycan.
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Post by CrewWolf » Tue Nov 15, 2005 5:38 pm

I'd think hunters would band together too. Heroics are all well and good but when werewolves are known to run in packs, you'll probably want someone to watch your back. I'm sure you can easily imagine some sort of werewolf hunting company under "Pest Control" in the phone book too :P
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Post by Akela » Tue Nov 15, 2005 7:23 pm

Ralith Lupus wrote:
Akela wrote:That's not really my point, the point is if there are multiple scenarios where an unharmed human is forced to fight a bear, not all will survive where as an unarmed werewolf should be able to beat a bear in all scenarios unlike the human.

With werewolves even the weak would survive, without, only the strong survive maintaining the strength and purity of the species.
There are plenty of things, other werewolves among them, that'd cause problems for a werewolf, and could even kill one off. Besides, if these people were so fanatic about that standpoint, what'd happen if they took a look at modern society? Everyone survives, because no life threatening challenges show up regularly. So, in fact, humanity would be much more 'impure' than any werewolf.
Point being that it isn't in our modern society but a xeno-phobic one.

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Post by white » Tue Nov 15, 2005 7:35 pm

Heh. That's the problem with this discussion. Any side can just point out that the hunters are illogical :)

On that note, who says our modern society isn't xenophobic? Even though there are a few of us that would be perfectly accepting, our society as a whole is most certainly not.
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Post by Akela » Tue Nov 15, 2005 7:43 pm

Not xenophobic enough where anything that deviates from the norm is executed.

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Post by Terastas » Tue Nov 15, 2005 8:50 pm

Well, the types of werewolf hunters would likely be as variable as werewolves themselves.
CrewWolf wrote:I'd think werewolf hunters would know the risks of becoming a werewolf quite well and would've pondered the possibility extensively. A werewolf hunter might be reluctant to kill a fellow hunter-turned-werewolf but he or she might also think that they're performing an act of mercy by putting their friend down, and the execution may even be expected for both parties.
Some might anticipate it, but not all werewolf hunters are professional. Some may have had personally traumatizing experiences to motivate them or undergone special training under a Whistler-like mentor, others probably just watched Van Helsing and decided it'd be cool to hunt werewolves like that (kind of like my two idiot roommates (who I mercifully no longer live with) that decided they were master poker players (and sequentially almost had to pay my rent for that month) right after they'd watched Rounders).

It's the unprofessional wannabe type -- the kind that thought more about what costume to wear than the risks they were taking -- that would be devastated.
Shadow Wulf wrote:I bet if a hunter has a wife or a girlfriend that turned into a werewolf and enjoys it, then he would become a werewolf too.
It really depends on what kind of hunter we're talking about. Someone with a personal experience concerning werewolves, or a Helsing wannabe might be momentarily stunned, and if the wife / girlfriend plays her cards right, could help said hunter into a period of acceptance.

A xenophobe or a religious crusader, on the other hand, might not even hesitate to kill his wife / girlfriend. Just the opposite: he may become even more infurriated with werewolves for "taking his love from him" ([spoiler]sort of like the way Blade still loved his mother even as he killed her[/spoiler]).

And to Akela and Vrikasatma:

They both seem like likely case scenarios. Werewolf hunters could and should be just as diverse in nature as human beings are.

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Post by white » Tue Nov 15, 2005 11:55 pm

Good point, Terastas.

@Akela: Well, as there are us few who would be accepting, there are also those who are illogical in respect to this. Those would be the werewolf hunters.
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Post by celtwolf » Wed Nov 16, 2005 1:08 am

i shall whine for a moment as i believe my idea/theory/whatever deserves reciprocation.
please, someone reply to my earlier post, or at least tell me that what i mentioned was already discussed and, thus, needs no further discussion.
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Post by white » Wed Nov 16, 2005 2:45 pm

celtwolf: Makes sense to me. I agree with it and don't really have anything to say past that, as you nicely summarised it.

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Post by Akela » Wed Nov 16, 2005 3:54 pm

Ralith Lupus wrote:Good point, Terastas.

@Akela: Well, as there are us few who would be accepting, there are also those who are illogical in respect to this. Those would be the werewolf hunters.
I never said everyone should accept it, it's my adaption and not even for our modern society.

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Post by Lupin » Wed Nov 16, 2005 3:57 pm

celtwolf wrote:one can assume that, once changed into a werewolf, a person pretty much has NO chance of living a normal life with those they are close to because they would DEFINITELY notice a change in behavior and appearnace and ask questions, and likely get answers. so one can assume that, to protect themselves and those they cared about in their once-normal life, a new werewolf would have to leave them.
I figure that depends a lot on how close they are to the other person, and the personality changes involved.. It's much less likely to happen to someone with a wife of 20 years than to someone who just met their girlfriend 2½ weeks ago.
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Okay...

Post by Alteron » Wed Nov 16, 2005 7:46 pm

Much as I would LIKE to say that the Xenophobia of days of yore is long gone and people won't lash out and attempt to destroy/kill/etc whatever is differant...
Sorry guys, it's NOT true. Ku Klux clan, skinheads, black panthers, and other groups... all from less then 50 years ago. And People will often report 'extremist' groups taht the officials refuse to believe exist.
The problem with being human in that you're human, subject to all the wonders and flaws.
Humans, as a general species, are afraid of what's new and differant, and tend to react with violence when stressed. That's what allowed humans to claw their way up tot he top of the food chain, but it's not nessisarly a good thing.
Ever seen Men in black? (the first one) A person is smart, s/he could probably handle a werewolf if introduced to one in the correct circumstances (walking in on a werewolf scarfing down a person, pet or other living ting PROBABLY would cause more trouble then love and flowers;)
But people? A dumb, panicy animal. That's what a mob is, that's why mobs form so quickly and care so little about what's happening around them. That's how Hitler gained such power. He knew PEOPLE. Pack them in tight, say what they want, ona subconcious level, to hear, get them riled and angry at something.
Hunters probably WOULD exist. There is simply no way that WW could hide their presence from everyone, though they could probably hide enough evidence to insure that the public at large wouldn't believe in them.
For the 'professional' type hunters, the ones that know what they're doing? It would probably be a group, with a handful of loners. It would probably also be a family business, each generation teaching the skills onto the next, people who marry into the family either ones who were 'hurt' by werewolves, are xenophobic, or just plain come to believe it over time. These families would be the most deadly and well-nigh unstoppable.

But in any case, even if WW Hunters as a whole didn't exist, WW would still be in danger of mob mentality, getting 'found out' and then being chased by people who don't realise their own mortality.

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Post by Lone_Wolf » Wed Nov 16, 2005 8:28 pm

People are threatened by change. When the world as they know it changes, a lot of people will do anything in their power to prevent it. Like Alteron says, people are afraid of anything different from them. People panic, and immediately all rational thought disappears and defense mode kicks in. I mean, if a wolf knocked on your door and started talking, I'm sure at least some of you (though certainly less than the general non-ww-loving public) would freak out a tad :P

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Post by Black Shuck » Wed Nov 16, 2005 9:04 pm

I agree with Alteron. I mean, if something we had been told for years didn't exist suddenly showed up infront of us, people would freak. There would be those who would say "Well, they are people, in part at the least" and leave werewolves alone, but I think a lot of mobs and riots would probably form.

As far as hunters, definately. There'd be some sort of underground organization that hunted down werewolves. It probably would be a family trade, maybe even kind of like a mafia where newcomers need to be initiated to prove their hatred of lycanthropes (if you were a hunter, you wouldn't want a spy from the prey coming in and spilling your secrets to the rest of the prey so they could the tables on you and hunt you. A spy could be dedicated to do whatever it took, but the initiation might deter a lot of potentials). The hunters may or may not be permanent, but there would be someone tracking at least one werewolf down for "extermination".
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