Strength of a werewolf, for both sexes

This is the place for discussion and voting on various aspects of werewolf life, social ideas, physical appearance, etc. Also a place to vote on how a werewolf should look.

How strong, generally speaking, would you like the male and female werewolves to be?

able to lift and throw a human
28
28%
able to lift but NOT throw a car
52
53%
able to lift AND throw a car
19
19%
 
Total votes: 99

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Strength of a werewolf, for both sexes

Post by NightmareHero » Sat Dec 04, 2004 2:57 am

Cast your vote at how strong you would like a werewolf to be....

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Post by ShadowFang » Sat Dec 04, 2004 4:51 am

Those silly humans. They need to be tossed around a bit more. :wink:

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Post by Silverclaw » Sat Dec 04, 2004 10:07 am

They would be strong enough to lift a car I think. NOT over their heads or anything like that, unless their a bodybuilder as a human. Some humans can lift a car so the average werewolf could as well. Please dont have them like Superman though. Throwing a human would be easy, and fun 8)

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Post by Lasthowl » Sat Dec 04, 2004 10:10 am

Heh. Reminds me of an old Choose Your Own Adventure book, where you as a werewolf lift a car's rear bumper up to try to keep them from getting away...

...and then it turns out to be a front-wheel drive car :)

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Post by Apokryltaros » Sat Dec 04, 2004 2:58 pm

Lasthowl wrote:Heh. Reminds me of an old Choose Your Own Adventure book, where you as a werewolf lift a car's rear bumper up to try to keep them from getting away...

...and then it turns out to be a front-wheel drive car :)
I have that one, even.

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Post by Terastas » Sat Dec 04, 2004 3:15 pm

Some humans can lift small cars, so if the lycanthropic shift increases the werewolf's mass, it would make sense that they would be able to do the same. I would draw the line at being able to throw the car though, mostly because giving the werewolf too much strength would turn it into a typical B-movie monster.

In terms of strength, a werewolf should definitely be able to toss around a human being or two, but lifting a car would take some effort. The only way I could picture one throwing a car at anything would be if it gripped it from the bottom at one side and then flipped it over and towards it's intended target, which I imagine a werewolf could do if it needed to. For the stereotypical lift-it-over-the-head-and-throw-it routine, that would require two werewolves, both to support the weight of the car and and to keep it balanced.

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Post by Sporty Fox » Mon Dec 06, 2004 9:47 am

I would prefere to see the strength kept realistic with the muscle mass of the werewolf. Do they need to be able to throw a car or even to lift one? Would they need to lift a victim instead of pulling them down by thier throat (you don't stand for long after the jugular has been punctured/removed)? The ability to lift, to me at least, would mean not only opposable thumbs (as discussed in a prior topic) BUT ALSO rotational wrist joints-something canids don't have. Again tho, do they need this superhuman strength at all? Assuming they have the normal lupine hearing, cunning, and smelling abilities and have learned how to use them to thier advantage, unrealistic strength is not needed and for me ruins any movie or story. They already would be able to out run and out jump a human, and with the better sences of a lupine/canid would be more than able to prey on humans.

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Post by ABrownrigg » Mon Dec 06, 2004 9:59 am

My own personal viewpoint, is no unusual strength enhancements. A creature of that density would be stronger than a human for sure. But to lift a car? it would have to be a very small car, and still then it would take effort. Muscles are muscles in my opinion, their density and mass would have to be so greatly increased on a werewolf to throw a car that the wolf would wind up looking almost deformed with buldges.

What I'm really leaning towards, unless someone can give me a good reason why not. Is that werewolf strength is based upon two elements. 1. The human before they change, (that would determine the amount of muscle mass the transformation had to work with) .. and 2. training... I'm not talking of werewolves lifting barbels or anything silly, but being in that form for an extended period of time gives you more control over it. And the longer you've been an infected werewolf type person. The more you will be able to use that new shifted mass to your advantage. (before I used this next example, let me be blunt, there will be NO KUNG FU WEREWOLVES in this movie! but as far as muscle training goes. i.e. Bruce lee, had immense power and strength, not because of large muscle mass, but knowing how to use it.

.... or if you want to go with wolf terms, look at a new puppy.. their legs are all gangly for the first year, just getting used to walking around that way, typically called 'puppy gait" over time they get used to the muscles and the best ways to use them.... knowing how to find the 'sweet spot' as it were.

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Post by Terastas » Mon Dec 06, 2004 10:17 am

*nod-nods* Realism is good, and the strength X skill formula is definitely something to consider. The only other element I would factor in to the strength formula would be the mental state.

Most human beings wouldn't even be able to lift anything that weighed more than themselves, yet you hear plenty of stories about people lifting cars off of old ladies and the like. Ordinarily a werewolf wouldn't be able to do something that unnatural, but under urgent conditions, feats beyond their normal capabilities would be more likely.

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Post by TakeWalker » Mon Dec 06, 2004 10:19 am

Aww, no Kung Fu werewolves? I'm sad... :lol:

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Post by ABrownrigg » Mon Dec 06, 2004 10:23 am

Ordinarily a werewolf wouldn't be able to do something that unnatural, but under urgent conditions, feats beyond their normal capabilities would be more likely.

Good point Terastas

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Post by NightmareHero » Mon Dec 06, 2004 10:39 am

works for me.

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Post by Bete » Thu Jan 13, 2005 1:42 pm

I voted in the middle (like the majority of you did), but let's just say I hope the film is artisitic enough to show more strength than a human, but not be too ridiculous, as I know that is not the director's intent. Hopefully the director will portray these scenes in their best "light," but I think he will, as he seems very in tune with what is needed for his film.

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Post by Uniform Two Six » Wed Sep 06, 2006 9:28 pm

I would have to disagree a little bit. Yeah, the werewolf should be limited by its physical form. As Terastas noted however, ordinary humans are capable of fairly surprising feats of strength under extreme curcumstances. He used the example of a major adrenaline rush (at least that's how I interpreted it) but look at people who are dosed on Phenycylcidene (PCP). Such people are not generally possessed of Schwarzenegger physiques, yet have been documented snapping handcuffs and flipping over small cars. The down side (for them at any rate) is that they at the very least suffer major injuries as they overtax their bodies doing this stuff, and quite often die shortly thereafter from anyeruisms or cardiac failure. The reason ordinary human beings cannot generally summon up such feats of strength (correct me if I'm wrong Scott) is that it doesn't make much sense from an evolutionary perspective for a creature to be able to accidentally kill itself. Thus ordinary folks can't do this kind of thing without an extreme (life or death) circumstance generating an adrenaline release, or resorting to dangerous drugs. In other words, something to short-circut the body's safety mechanisms. If the werewolf has regenerative capabilities, it doesn't really need to worry about physical injury from overexertion since any such injuries will be quickly healed. It would be believable to have a werewolf with the ability to voluntarily enter a state that would provide extreme strength (voluntary release of massive amounts of adrenaline, for instance), since overexertion is not life-threatening, as it would be to an ordinary human. I think werewolves should have the strength of a human of similar size and muscle mass if that human were on PCP. That makes sense to me.

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Post by JoshuaMadoc » Wed Sep 06, 2006 11:35 pm

I like my werewolves be able to kick a car around like a soccer ball.

*kicks 10 sedans out of the window*

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Post by Vuldari » Wed Sep 06, 2006 11:46 pm

kitetsu wrote:I like my werewolves be able to kick a car around like a soccer ball.

*kicks 10 sedans out of the window*
Would you stop Defenestrating sedans allready!...

...you're making a terrible mess... *tsk tsk*


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Post by MoonKit » Thu Sep 07, 2006 7:46 am

Silverclaw wrote:They would be strong enough to lift a car I think. NOT over their heads or anything like that, unless their a bodybuilder as a human. Some humans can lift a car so the average werewolf could as well. Please dont have them like Superman though. Throwing a human would be easy, and fun 8)
My thoughts exactly! :D
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Post by Kisota » Thu Sep 07, 2006 3:51 pm

I third that! :lol:

Rather than focusing on a werewolf's strength, there should be more priority on a balance of strength and agility.

Leave the car-throwing to Superman, and the Superman-throwing to werewolves! :D

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Post by Uniform Two Six » Thu Sep 07, 2006 7:34 pm

I don't see why you cannot have both. Look at olympic gymnasts or ballet dancers. Those people are the most lithe, supple human beings on the planet... and they're at least AMONG the strongest as well. There was a group of Marines in Philadelphia in the 80s that made the unforgivable mistake of questioning the manliness of a group of male ballet dancers. Said individuals challenged the Marines (who were presumably the big burly types) to a physical training challenge (sit-ups, pull-ups, push-ups, that kind of thing). Long story - short, the Marines lost... by a landslide. And I guarantee you, physical training is what the Marines spend most of their time doing (during peacetime at any rate).
Anyway, back on topic. I have always seen physical grace and physical strength as being strongly related. Just as in gymnasts and similar athletes, I'd think a werewolf with tremendous agility, would almost necessarily have great physical strength as well. I can't see why one would preclude the other.

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Post by Scott Gardener » Thu Sep 07, 2006 9:53 pm

The "secret reserve" strength that lets ordinary people heroically lift cars to free old ladies, while documented in medical literature, is probably not something that can be tapped into with gamma radiation to turn people into The Incredible Hulk.

A lot of strength is a combination of will and localization of forces. I've broken boards in Tae Kwon Do myself, and it's fairly easy--I'm sure at least a few others here have, too. I've watched people break bricks, even. It looks pretty impressive, especially when you hold the bricks before and after. But, in order for it to work, you have to hit it the right way, and you have to turn off the mental assumption that breaking a brick is difficult.

Ever lean forward in a car with the seatbelt on and it click and stop you from leaning forward? If you're consciously leaning forward, it doesn't happen--only when you're thinking about something else. That's because the body moves with greater strength when operating automatically than when being guided consciously. That's one of the reasons why so many activities like martial arts or athletics emphasize making it a subconscious routine.

A lot of the super strength demos we see on "Believe It Or Not" type shows is not so much brute force as it is localization of forces. I watched a guy let the front tire of a semi rig run over his chest. But, he had to psych himself up for it first; he stopped the stunt the first time, because he wasn't quite ready. He then proceded with it, and it indeed happened; the tire was above a pair of wedges and passed over his mid abdomen while he exhaled. It was a pretty impressive sight.

Still, muscles cannot operate like this continuously for more than a few seconds. Had the truck stopped rather than continuing forward, the guy I'm sure would have been squashed.

Still, I'm sure at least some of this superhuman-ness is accessible, but I don't see werewolves throwing cars at people in my own storylines. They're more agility and speed than brute force.
Taking a Gestalt approach, since it's the "in" thing...

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Post by Uniform Two Six » Thu Sep 07, 2006 10:40 pm

Okay, I guess I can see that. But, back to my example of the dude on PCP. If snapping a pair of flex-cuffs only required muscle-memory and concentration, how does the guy on PCP do it? I'm guessing that most PCP users aren't the kung-fu masters of concentration. Theoretically, they shouldn't be capable of anything out of the ordinary (especially since PCP actually has some sedative properties). I have to figure something else is going on there, and it's been explained to me that it essentially suppresses the body's cut-off reflex which normally keeps oneself from overexerting oneself. So Scott, two questions:

1. Did I get this entirely wrong?

2. Is it unrealistic for a werewolf to be able to enter that state voluntarily at will since overexertion isn't a survival risk because of regenerative abilities?

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Post by Set » Thu Sep 07, 2006 11:01 pm

Silverclaw wrote:They would be strong enough to lift a car I think.
What's with people's obsession with super strength?

And why in hell would a werewolf NEED to be able to lift a car?

How did I not vote in this? Null vote, the options suck.

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Post by Uniform Two Six » Fri Sep 08, 2006 12:00 am

Set wrote: What's with people's obsession with super strength?

And why in hell would a werewolf NEED to be able to lift a car?
1. Super strength would be fun.

2. Uh... I don't know WHY a werewolf would NEED to lift a car.... but you have to admit, it would LOOK pretty darn cool.

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Re: I feel ranty tonight.

Post by JoshuaMadoc » Fri Sep 08, 2006 1:08 am

Set wrote:
Silverclaw wrote:They would be strong enough to lift a car I think.
What's with people's obsession with super strength?

And why in hell would a werewolf NEED to be able to lift a car?

How did I not vote in this? Null vote, the options suck.
Dude, stop throwing the book at everyone.

There isn't even -A- book on this matter.

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Post by Lukas » Fri Sep 08, 2006 7:39 am

you can not forget that if a person is rally worked up the adredaline (i know I spelled it wrong, who cares :P ) juices give the said person a extra boost
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